Discussion:
STEVE GARTIN lies & lies & lies
(too old to reply)
LIBERATOR
2003-11-15 21:13:35 UTC
Permalink
I re-read the story in Inside KungFu Magazine, and noticed there was
no explanation of timing, footwork, cadence, telegraphy, fight
history, but instead a lot of ancient history of which Gartin is
claiming his style has no authentic lineage, that he himself has made
it up by two different countries.

Dutch & Indonesia.

So, as it's reported by Gartin/Jundt in the magazine, they made it up,
and they've never fought themselves and proven it works.

And here in Denver we have 4 schools all Korean domineering experts in
knife fighting, yet Gartin & Chas & their crackpot propaganda bullshit
platoon do everything they can to make sure they never cross paths
with all these schools.

Essentially, when the government commits fraud against trusting
people, they hire propaganda artists. Chas has proven to be one of
these types of people. He talks real pretty, trys to display a higher
education, and out of what he would like you to believe is random,
talks a real good anti-Jeffco story. But I know for a fact Jeffco and
all officials in Jeffco are knowingly taking part in high levels of
fraud in almost all channels of government regarding all activity of
government (county).

And I believe Chas is one of their hired "he's just a citizen" stooge,
who talks a good show, who now that they are shuffling in new
presences for the sheriff, they need to make it look as if this
sheriff and the last sheriff who was removed because they say he was a
drunk (he wasn't, it was all staged, apparently many shuffles of power
is believed to be a true change in power), and the last sheriff
(Stone, the hired fall guy paid 2 million for his psyop work), are not
working together but instead separate interests or "new presence". But
the truth of the matter is they're all front men hired by Hollywood
people to play act. And Chas is support staff and I believe he's being
supplimented someway.

But that's irrelevant to his self-propping of his abilities, all talk
and propaganda. No fighting, he refuses to fight anyone, and like I
said, Tiger Kim, JW Kim, Ki Martial Arts, U.S. Tae Kwon Do Center,
Martinez TKD are all highly skilled in knife fighting, yet Chas won't
spar with them, compete with them, simply because his lies won't hold
up once he's been beaten publically.

Look at the photos in Inside KungFu of Gartin, they are absolutely
hilarious. Clearly by these photos he does not have a clue about real
fighting.

Chas & Gartin are con-artists, and I believe Chas is a government
propaganda person who plays "just ordinary citizen who is pissed".

It doesn't really matter, the guy can't fight if his life dependended
on it.
Dougie®
2003-11-15 23:32:35 UTC
Permalink
Libby, if Chas or Steve wanted to find you they would and God
help you that day because no TKD would stop them from skinning you
alive.

Dougie®
http://fatehfightclub.tripod.com/fateh.html
LIBERATOR
2003-11-16 05:55:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dougie®
Libby, if Chas or Steve wanted to find you they would and God
help you that day because no TKD would stop them from skinning you
alive.
Dougie®
http://fatehfightclub.tripod.com/fateh.html
ARe you one of the silat practitioners?

You are in Denver?

I'm wide open for challenges. Talk is cheap.
Dougie®
2003-11-16 06:59:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by LIBERATOR
ARe you one of the silat practitioners?
Nope. I have had the chance to be shown some grappling silat
and visited a silat school but that's about it.
Post by LIBERATOR
You are in Denver?
Nope.
Post by LIBERATOR
I'm wide open for challenges. Talk is cheap.
Bring it.

Dougie®
http://fatehfightclub.tripod.com/fateh.html
Steve Gartin
2004-01-18 03:02:10 UTC
Permalink
No Lippy, I'm a Serak practitioner and a KunTao Silat practitioner and will
joyfully meet with you at the ODF seminar on February 7, 2004 at 10 PM in
Longmont, Colorado to show you either art, your choice. Be there, or
forever bear the ignominious defeat that you and all TKD people you foist
upon us here will inevitably bear after meeting with Serak. If you think
silat and Serak are the same thing, you have an awakening awaiting. You
asked for a time and place: 10AM 7 February 2004 - Longmont, Colorado:
www.kuntaosilat.com
Maha Guru Steve Gartin - Tendjek SerMal
www.tendjek.com
Post by LIBERATOR
Post by Dougie®
Libby, if Chas or Steve wanted to find you they would and God
help you that day because no TKD would stop them from skinning you
alive.
Dougie®
http://fatehfightclub.tripod.com/fateh.html
ARe you one of the silat practitioners?
You are in Denver?
I'm wide open for challenges. Talk is cheap.
story
2004-01-18 15:18:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Gartin
upon us here will inevitably bear after meeting with Serak. If you think
silat and Serak are the same thing, you have an awakening awaiting.
????? I thought that Serak was a kind of Silat. Is it not? If not then what
is the difference?

.................Tom...................
Chas
2004-01-18 15:50:40 UTC
Permalink
Post by story
Post by Steve Gartin
upon us here will inevitably bear after meeting with Serak. If you think
silat and Serak are the same thing, you have an awakening awaiting.
????? I thought that Serak was a kind of Silat. Is it not? If not then what
is the difference?
'Silat/silek' just means 'fighting' (in simple).
Serak(tm) is a particular system of silat, of which there are, literally,
hundreds.
If you've seen 'silat', that doesn't necessarily mean that it was Serak.
Even if you've seen serak from other practitioners- Suwanda lineage, Wetzel
lineage, Reeders lineage, it doesn't mean that you've seen the Serak of Mas
Djoet, Mas Roen or of Pak Serak himself. They are from different senior
students of Pak Serak and emphasize different aspects of his art than we do.
It's all real complicated, and doesn't mean much to anyone but us <g>
Another aspect is that 'tendjekan' is the very old word for fighting- it
means to 'obliterate' or 'crush'; to 'stomp' or 'pound'. It kinda predates
the use of the word 'silat', and kind of implies a 'rough' or 'brusque' art
predicated on attack rather than defense. It's an attitude of a warrior
(pangau); rather than being responsive, it's far more pro-active.
A lot of people feel that silat has become diluted, mitigated. The practice
of 'pentjak' (choreography) has become the end unto itself (like kata
queens), and using a different word differentiates the sorts of practice.

Chas
story
2004-01-19 01:31:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chas
Post by story
Post by Steve Gartin
upon us here will inevitably bear after meeting with Serak. If you
think
Post by story
Post by Steve Gartin
silat and Serak are the same thing, you have an awakening awaiting.
????? I thought that Serak was a kind of Silat. Is it not? If not then
what
Post by story
is the difference?
'Silat/silek' just means 'fighting' (in simple).
Serak(tm) is a particular system of silat, of which there are, literally,
hundreds.
O.K. then Serak is Silat but Silat is not necessarily Serak
Post by Chas
If you've seen 'silat', that doesn't necessarily mean that it was Serak.
I know this. The Silat I have seen is not Serak
Post by Chas
It's all real complicated, and doesn't mean much to anyone but us <g>
IOW just like the differences between some styles of Karate. Doesn't mean
squat unless you actually practice one of the arts under discussion.

Bottom line seems to be that Silat is a collective word like Karate whereas
Serak is a more specific word like Jundokan.

...............................Tom.........................
Chas
2004-01-19 01:42:43 UTC
Permalink
Post by story
Bottom line seems to be that Silat is a collective word like Karate whereas
Serak is a more specific word like Jundokan.
Exactly.

c.
Steve Gartin
2004-01-18 20:45:02 UTC
Permalink
Good day Tom,
Post by story
Post by Steve Gartin
upon us here will inevitably bear after meeting with Serak. If you think
silat and Serak are the same thing, you have an awakening awaiting.
????? I thought that Serak was a kind of Silat. Is it not? If not then what
is the difference?
.................Tom...................
Actually, any martial art from Indonesia can be termed *silat* - even kuntao
is often called silat. Most of the silat people here have seen is the
*flower* - the practice. Serak principles are taught from the beginning
with the *tendjekan* or striking/grappling - the platform, giving the
student an understanding of angles and levers so that they can train
application of the core concepts. Serak is also known for the *pukulan* or
*poekoelan* - colliding or *crashing in* principle, which seems to be a
consistent thread in the de Thouars family of silat systems. Although Serak
is technically silat, it is as different from most silat as muy thai is from
wushu.

So basically, Pak Vic is adamant about drawing a distinction between the
dancers and magicians of silat and Serak.

Have a great day,
Steve Gartin
www.tendjek.com
Chas
2004-01-18 20:58:45 UTC
Permalink
....Serak is also known for the *pukulan* or
*poekoelan* - colliding or *crashing in* principle, which seems to be a
consistent thread in the de Thouars family of silat systems.
And it's one that makes it particularly suitable for opponents that want to
engage from a very close combative distance. Much of silat is concerned with
evasion/avoidance, and the pukulans are very different from that- everything
is done from close contact distance.

Chas
+-
2004-01-18 22:57:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Chas
....Serak is also known for the *pukulan* or
*poekoelan* - colliding or *crashing in* principle, which seems to be a
consistent thread in the de Thouars family of silat systems.
And it's one that makes it particularly suitable for opponents that want
to engage from a very close combative distance. Much of silat is concerned
with evasion/avoidance, and the pukulans are very different from that-
everything is done from close contact distance.
Chas
with Libby's grasp of reality, wouldn't Pokemon be more appropriate?
--
+-; the point where things begin and end, where the end is start and start
comes to it's final end.....
George
2004-01-19 07:10:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Gartin
So basically, Pak Vic is adamant about drawing a distinction between the
dancers and magicians of silat and Serak.
Mr Steve,

I KNOW Pak Vic has shown you Serak magic. I KNOW you can do Serak magic.
Don't ever forget the magic of Serak, it's most important. IIRC, Jerry
McCleary taught a bit of Serak magic on the Blades of Thunder tape.

George
KunTao Lai Lai
2023-10-08 19:48:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by LIBERATOR
Post by Dougie®
Libby, if Chas or Steve wanted to find you they would and God
help you that day because no TKD would stop them from skinning you
alive.
Dougie®
http://fatehfightclub.tripod.com/fateh.html
ARe you one of the silat practitioners?
You are in Denver?
I'm wide open for challenges. Talk is cheap.
Greetings. My Uncle was Brendan Lai of the 7 Stars Praying Mantis and was at one time a "Inside Kung Fu" Editor. Brendan Lai is a Martial Arts Hall of Famer in "Black Belt Magazine" several times over and is a icon in the world of Martial Arts. It is impolite to say what you have said because it implies the The De Thouars Family are also fake? They are not and they are a Humble asian Family. IF you only think that Martial Arts is in Korea and Japan or just Chinese then you have missed the point of Martial strategy altogether? When your ego speaks only then your brian does not use you mouth. I will quote the Sages of old that no one ever listens too until they are dead or look like fools. If one talks to a fool one vecomes a fool. Excessive claims of what is a martial art is irrelevant to any Martial Art because Martial Art is STRATEGY! If you depend on anothers strategy to win your wars or your life without your own brain being involved then you truely do not know why the words "I" and Flags or Countries should NEVER be used when addressing Martial Study. "I" does not exist and if there were no flags then there would only be people? “Mistakes are always forgivable, if one has the courage to admit them.” “Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.” “No one should be ashamed to admit they are wrong, which is but saying, in other words, that they are wiser today than they were yesterday.” Lao Tzu...teacher to Confucius. When virtue is lost, benevolence appears, when benevolence is lost right conduct appears, when right conduct is lost, expedience appears. Expediency is the mere shadow of right and truth; it is the beginning of disorder.

Those who have knowledge, don't predict. Those who predict, don't have knowledge.

Let us study firther Moral and mental Strategy which is NEVER taught in American Martial Arts:

The outcome of a fight between warriors was decided by the severity of their wounds.
...one must look beyond the wounds to win the fight. “The purpose of today’s training is to defeat yesterday’s understanding.”
To win any battle, you must fight as if you are already dead. You win battles by knowing the enemy’s timing, and using a timing which the enemy does not expect. The important thing in strategy is to suppress the enemy's useful actions but allow his useless actions.
The path that leads to truth is littered with the bodies of the ignorant.


"Silence is better than unmeaning words."
-Pathagoras

"A system of morality which is based on relative emotional values is a mere illusion, a thoroughly vulgar conception which has nothing sound in it and nothing true."
Steve Gartin
2003-11-20 03:39:06 UTC
Permalink
Naw,
You're right about finding him IF we wanted to, but he's an avowed TKD
pimp - worthy of spanking maybe, but not skinning. :-)>

Steve
www.kuntaosilat.net
Post by Dougie®
Libby, if Chas or Steve wanted to find you they would and God
help you that day because no TKD would stop them from skinning you
alive.
Dougie®
http://fatehfightclub.tripod.com/fateh.html
Steve Gartin
2003-11-20 03:35:47 UTC
Permalink
Howdy,
Post by LIBERATOR
I re-read the story in Inside KungFu Magazine, and noticed there was
no explanation of timing, footwork, cadence, telegraphy, fight
history, but instead a lot of ancient history of which Gartin is
claiming his style has no authentic lineage, that he himself has made
it up by two different countries.
My lineage is posted on www.kuntaosilat.com
Post by LIBERATOR
Dutch & Indonesia.
Wrong again. China and Indonesia - my teachers are Dutch/Indonesian and
Chinese/Indonesian.
Post by LIBERATOR
So, as it's reported by Gartin/Jundt in the magazine, they made it up,
and they've never fought themselves and proven it works.
Wrong again. Joe is a consumate martial artist who has had more fights than
you've had delusions Lib.
Post by LIBERATOR
And here in Denver we have 4 schools all Korean domineering experts in
knife fighting, yet Gartin & Chas & their crackpot propaganda bullshit
platoon do everything they can to make sure they never cross paths
with all these schools.
I'm sure they are fine schools Lib; I have other interests to occupy my
time.
Post by LIBERATOR
Essentially, when the government commits fraud against trusting
people, they hire propaganda artists. Chas has proven to be one of
these types of people. He talks real pretty, trys to display a higher
education, and out of what he would like you to believe is random,
talks a real good anti-Jeffco story.
That's because he has been an eye-witness to the pervasive criminal conduct
of every level of government in Colorado.
Post by LIBERATOR
But I know for a fact Jeffco and
all officials in Jeffco are knowingly taking part in high levels of
fraud in almost all channels of government regarding all activity of
government (county).
I'm shocked! The Liberator has at last spoken the truth. (it can't last)
Post by LIBERATOR
And I believe Chas is one of their hired "he's just a citizen" stooge,
who talks a good show, who now that they are shuffling in new
presences for the sheriff, they need to make it look as if this
sheriff and the last sheriff who was removed because they say he was a
drunk (he wasn't, it was all staged, apparently many shuffles of power
is believed to be a true change in power), and the last sheriff
(Stone, the hired fall guy paid 2 million for his psyop work), are not
working together but instead separate interests or "new presence". But
the truth of the matter is they're all front men hired by Hollywood
people to play act. And Chas is support staff and I believe he's being
supplimented someway.
Whew, non compos mentis doesn't begin to describe your problems Lib.
Post by LIBERATOR
But that's irrelevant to his self-propping of his abilities, all talk
and propaganda. No fighting, he refuses to fight anyone, and like I
said, Tiger Kim, JW Kim, Ki Martial Arts, U.S. Tae Kwon Do Center,
Martinez TKD are all highly skilled in knife fighting, yet Chas won't
spar with them, compete with them, simply because his lies won't hold
up once he's been beaten publically.
Lib, with YHVH's good grace our fighting days are over. We have absolutely
nothing to prove to you. You could not afford to pay tuition . . . what do
we owe you? I'm taking my time to answer your more cogent ravings, but I'm
tiring of you rapidly. You're even more stupid than Hal (IH).
Post by LIBERATOR
Look at the photos in Inside KungFu of Gartin, they are absolutely
hilarious. Clearly by these photos he does not have a clue about real
fighting.
Tell me Lib, when have you ever conducted or participated in a photo shoot.
Show me the URL . . . you goffy fake.
Post by LIBERATOR
Chas & Gartin are con-artists, and I believe Chas is a government
propaganda person who plays "just ordinary citizen who is pissed".
No, he jest plays one on TV . . . on the MKUltra Manchurian Movement.
Post by LIBERATOR
It doesn't really matter, the guy can't fight if his life dependended
on it.
It has and he did. He's still here Lib and you would be well advised to
just leave that old man alone. You just want a sound drubbing and that you
can get from the youngsters at the schools IF nothing else will satisfy your
silly ass.

Stop the government drugs Lib and you'll start coming back to reality.

Steve
www.kuntaosilat.net
Steve Gartin
2004-01-17 14:21:35 UTC
Permalink
Good day all,
Just wanted to let you all know that I teach every Wednesday at 5:00PM at
9350 W. 20th Street in Lakewood. The practice leader is Travis Crosby and
the classes are held at his massage therapy office. Please call Travis at
303-232-9520 for any additional information.
Have a wonderful day,
Steve Gartin
www.kuntaosilat.com
Post by LIBERATOR
I re-read the story in Inside KungFu Magazine, and noticed there was
no explanation of timing, footwork, cadence, telegraphy, fight
history, but instead a lot of ancient history of which Gartin is
claiming his style has no authentic lineage, that he himself has made
it up by two different countries.
Dutch & Indonesia.
So, as it's reported by Gartin/Jundt in the magazine, they made it up,
and they've never fought themselves and proven it works.
And here in Denver we have 4 schools all Korean domineering experts in
knife fighting, yet Gartin & Chas & their crackpot propaganda bullshit
platoon do everything they can to make sure they never cross paths
with all these schools.
Essentially, when the government commits fraud against trusting
people, they hire propaganda artists. Chas has proven to be one of
these types of people. He talks real pretty, trys to display a higher
education, and out of what he would like you to believe is random,
talks a real good anti-Jeffco story. But I know for a fact Jeffco and
all officials in Jeffco are knowingly taking part in high levels of
fraud in almost all channels of government regarding all activity of
government (county).
And I believe Chas is one of their hired "he's just a citizen" stooge,
who talks a good show, who now that they are shuffling in new
presences for the sheriff, they need to make it look as if this
sheriff and the last sheriff who was removed because they say he was a
drunk (he wasn't, it was all staged, apparently many shuffles of power
is believed to be a true change in power), and the last sheriff
(Stone, the hired fall guy paid 2 million for his psyop work), are not
working together but instead separate interests or "new presence". But
the truth of the matter is they're all front men hired by Hollywood
people to play act. And Chas is support staff and I believe he's being
supplimented someway.
But that's irrelevant to his self-propping of his abilities, all talk
and propaganda. No fighting, he refuses to fight anyone, and like I
said, Tiger Kim, JW Kim, Ki Martial Arts, U.S. Tae Kwon Do Center,
Martinez TKD are all highly skilled in knife fighting, yet Chas won't
spar with them, compete with them, simply because his lies won't hold
up once he's been beaten publically.
Look at the photos in Inside KungFu of Gartin, they are absolutely
hilarious. Clearly by these photos he does not have a clue about real
fighting.
Chas & Gartin are con-artists, and I believe Chas is a government
propaganda person who plays "just ordinary citizen who is pissed".
It doesn't really matter, the guy can't fight if his life dependended
on it.
Steve Gartin
2005-03-14 22:53:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Gartin
Good day all,
Just wanted to let you all know that I teach every Wednesday at 5:00PM at
9350 W. 20th Street in Lakewood. The practice leader is Travis Crosby and
the classes are held at his massage therapy office. Please call Travis at
303-232-9520 for any additional information.
Have a wonderful day,
Steve Gartin
www.kuntaosilat.com
Post by LIBERATOR
I re-read the story in Inside KungFu Magazine, and noticed there was
no explanation of timing, footwork, cadence, telegraphy, fight
history, but instead a lot of ancient history of which Gartin is
claiming his style has no authentic lineage, that he himself has made
it up by two different countries.
Dutch & Indonesia.
So, as it's reported by Gartin/Jundt in the magazine, they made it up,
and they've never fought themselves and proven it works.
And here in Denver we have 4 schools all Korean domineering experts in
knife fighting, yet Gartin & Chas & their crackpot propaganda bullshit
platoon do everything they can to make sure they never cross paths
with all these schools.
Essentially, when the government commits fraud against trusting
people, they hire propaganda artists. Chas has proven to be one of
these types of people. He talks real pretty, trys to display a higher
education, and out of what he would like you to believe is random,
talks a real good anti-Jeffco story. But I know for a fact Jeffco and
all officials in Jeffco are knowingly taking part in high levels of
fraud in almost all channels of government regarding all activity of
government (county).
And I believe Chas is one of their hired "he's just a citizen" stooge,
who talks a good show, who now that they are shuffling in new
presences for the sheriff, they need to make it look as if this
sheriff and the last sheriff who was removed because they say he was a
drunk (he wasn't, it was all staged, apparently many shuffles of power
is believed to be a true change in power), and the last sheriff
(Stone, the hired fall guy paid 2 million for his psyop work), are not
working together but instead separate interests or "new presence". But
the truth of the matter is they're all front men hired by Hollywood
people to play act. And Chas is support staff and I believe he's being
supplimented someway.
But that's irrelevant to his self-propping of his abilities, all talk
and propaganda. No fighting, he refuses to fight anyone, and like I
said, Tiger Kim, JW Kim, Ki Martial Arts, U.S. Tae Kwon Do Center,
Martinez TKD are all highly skilled in knife fighting, yet Chas won't
spar with them, compete with them, simply because his lies won't hold
up once he's been beaten publically.
Look at the photos in Inside KungFu of Gartin, they are absolutely
hilarious. Clearly by these photos he does not have a clue about real
fighting.
Chas & Gartin are con-artists, and I believe Chas is a government
propaganda person who plays "just ordinary citizen who is pissed".
It doesn't really matter, the guy can't fight if his life dependended
on it.
Recovering from a computer crash and starting RMA all over and discovered
some LIE-BERATOR, et al posts that I didn't respond to, so I'll do my
obligatory 'thanks' for starting a new thread with my name on it and
IDENTIFY LIE-BERATOR, et al as operatives of the Joint Terrorism Task Farce
www.jointterrorismtaskforce.com working en masse under the code name
LIBERATOR, as disinformationalists. This is Jefferson County Sheriff's
Intelligence Donald L. Estep, who can't keep the capslock under control,
working the night shift. Notice the timing of his posts.

I'll also take the time to point out that there has been a long history of
'Libby' stalking us and not showing up at any of *their* challenges
www.kuntaosilat.com/libby.htm.

And, as usual, I'll throw in a plug for posterity ~ or prosperity, to-wit:
Lanka Dua DVD is done and ready for shipment and a special on the Four
Heartless Monkey Knife DVDs is available at: www.kuntaosilat.com/DVDs.html
and at www.heartlessmonkey.com

Ya'll have a nice day now: www.docslaw.com/images/RICO.pdf

Steve Gartin
www.willemdethouars.com
Steve Gartin
2004-01-17 15:11:39 UTC
Permalink
Oh hey! Since the Liporator has been so kind as to start a ton of threads
with my name on them, I'll take advantage of the free advertising and tell
you all about the Offensive/Defensive Force Course in Longmont on 7 February
from 10 - 3 PM. Pak Vic is coming to Denver to meet with the prototype
people who are building the first of the Sangat Blades for the SHOT show
this year. He will take one day out to present an ODF course for the public
and another day to work with the local seniors on Serak.

The ODF course was originally designed to teach law enforcement personnel
how to safely deal with a knife attack. The streets are getting no safer
and the Citizens have need of the same knowledge, so Pak Vic has now opened
ODF up to the public. This will be the first public viewing of this
technology and is a must-see for anyone who has ever thought it would be
wise to learn how to defend against a knife attack.

It's a short course, lots of information for further practice, but several
keys that you can walk away with that will make a difference in the sad
event that you may need them.

As a bonus for those instructors and gurus attending, Pak Vic will
demonstrate several principles from the 2nd and 3rd level of Serak at the
conclusion of the ODF seminar and provide instruction by appointment either
before or after the seminar. Click on the link at: www.kuntaosilat.com call
Jim about details.

And by the way, Danny Inosanto does INDEED study Serak with Pak Vic every
week. He also teaches Serak up to level 6 or 7. From what Pak Vic tells
me, Danny teaches verbatim the Serak curriculum.

Ya'll have a great day,
Steve Gartin
www.tendjek.com
Post by LIBERATOR
I re-read the story in Inside KungFu Magazine, and noticed there was
no explanation of timing, footwork, cadence, telegraphy, fight
history, but instead a lot of ancient history of which Gartin is
claiming his style has no authentic lineage, that he himself has made
it up by two different countries.
Dutch & Indonesia.
So, as it's reported by Gartin/Jundt in the magazine, they made it up,
and they've never fought themselves and proven it works.
And here in Denver we have 4 schools all Korean domineering experts in
knife fighting, yet Gartin & Chas & their crackpot propaganda bullshit
platoon do everything they can to make sure they never cross paths
with all these schools.
Essentially, when the government commits fraud against trusting
people, they hire propaganda artists. Chas has proven to be one of
these types of people. He talks real pretty, trys to display a higher
education, and out of what he would like you to believe is random,
talks a real good anti-Jeffco story. But I know for a fact Jeffco and
all officials in Jeffco are knowingly taking part in high levels of
fraud in almost all channels of government regarding all activity of
government (county).
And I believe Chas is one of their hired "he's just a citizen" stooge,
who talks a good show, who now that they are shuffling in new
presences for the sheriff, they need to make it look as if this
sheriff and the last sheriff who was removed because they say he was a
drunk (he wasn't, it was all staged, apparently many shuffles of power
is believed to be a true change in power), and the last sheriff
(Stone, the hired fall guy paid 2 million for his psyop work), are not
working together but instead separate interests or "new presence". But
the truth of the matter is they're all front men hired by Hollywood
people to play act. And Chas is support staff and I believe he's being
supplimented someway.
But that's irrelevant to his self-propping of his abilities, all talk
and propaganda. No fighting, he refuses to fight anyone, and like I
said, Tiger Kim, JW Kim, Ki Martial Arts, U.S. Tae Kwon Do Center,
Martinez TKD are all highly skilled in knife fighting, yet Chas won't
spar with them, compete with them, simply because his lies won't hold
up once he's been beaten publically.
Look at the photos in Inside KungFu of Gartin, they are absolutely
hilarious. Clearly by these photos he does not have a clue about real
fighting.
Chas & Gartin are con-artists, and I believe Chas is a government
propaganda person who plays "just ordinary citizen who is pissed".
It doesn't really matter, the guy can't fight if his life dependended
on it.
Steve Gartin
2004-01-28 04:51:42 UTC
Permalink
Well, it is almost 10 PM and Lispi hasn't given me a location to meet him
for coffee tomorrow at 11AM, so I'm going to continue my very busy day
without scheduling Lispi in. I'll be spending the day with my attorney . .
. you all have his number if you want to contact me . . . and you have my
number, and Chas' . . . AND you all know where my classes are and where the
ODF Seminar is.

Any questions?

Steve Gartin 720-404-1812
www.kuntaosilat.com
www.thunderrock.net
Post by LIBERATOR
I re-read the story in Inside KungFu Magazine, and noticed there was
no explanation of timing, footwork, cadence, telegraphy, fight
history, but instead a lot of ancient history of which Gartin is
claiming his style has no authentic lineage, that he himself has made
it up by two different countries.
Dutch & Indonesia.
So, as it's reported by Gartin/Jundt in the magazine, they made it up,
and they've never fought themselves and proven it works.
And here in Denver we have 4 schools all Korean domineering experts in
knife fighting, yet Gartin & Chas & their crackpot propaganda bullshit
platoon do everything they can to make sure they never cross paths
with all these schools.
Essentially, when the government commits fraud against trusting
people, they hire propaganda artists. Chas has proven to be one of
these types of people. He talks real pretty, trys to display a higher
education, and out of what he would like you to believe is random,
talks a real good anti-Jeffco story. But I know for a fact Jeffco and
all officials in Jeffco are knowingly taking part in high levels of
fraud in almost all channels of government regarding all activity of
government (county).
And I believe Chas is one of their hired "he's just a citizen" stooge,
who talks a good show, who now that they are shuffling in new
presences for the sheriff, they need to make it look as if this
sheriff and the last sheriff who was removed because they say he was a
drunk (he wasn't, it was all staged, apparently many shuffles of power
is believed to be a true change in power), and the last sheriff
(Stone, the hired fall guy paid 2 million for his psyop work), are not
working together but instead separate interests or "new presence". But
the truth of the matter is they're all front men hired by Hollywood
people to play act. And Chas is support staff and I believe he's being
supplimented someway.
But that's irrelevant to his self-propping of his abilities, all talk
and propaganda. No fighting, he refuses to fight anyone, and like I
said, Tiger Kim, JW Kim, Ki Martial Arts, U.S. Tae Kwon Do Center,
Martinez TKD are all highly skilled in knife fighting, yet Chas won't
spar with them, compete with them, simply because his lies won't hold
up once he's been beaten publically.
Look at the photos in Inside KungFu of Gartin, they are absolutely
hilarious. Clearly by these photos he does not have a clue about real
fighting.
Chas & Gartin are con-artists, and I believe Chas is a government
propaganda person who plays "just ordinary citizen who is pissed".
It doesn't really matter, the guy can't fight if his life dependended
on it.
Steve Gartin
2004-05-24 04:17:06 UTC
Permalink
Good day all,
Once again Mark Zahn has issued challenges and then failed to appear.
www.tendjek.com/kempofirst.htm
Good night.
Steve :-)>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
www.kuntaosilat.com
Mark Zahn ruiner of Gartin Fraud Witch Con Corp.
www.kuntaosilat.com/Dougco.htm
Steve Gartin : -)>>>>>>>
Post by LIBERATOR
I re-read the story in Inside KungFu Magazine, and noticed there was
no explanation of timing, footwork, cadence, telegraphy, fight
history, but instead a lot of ancient history of which Gartin is
claiming his style has no authentic lineage, that he himself has made
it up by two different countries.
Dutch & Indonesia.
So, as it's reported by Gartin/Jundt in the magazine, they made it up,
and they've never fought themselves and proven it works.
And here in Denver we have 4 schools all Korean domineering experts in
knife fighting, yet Gartin & Chas & their crackpot propaganda bullshit
platoon do everything they can to make sure they never cross paths
with all these schools.
Essentially, when the government commits fraud against trusting
people, they hire propaganda artists. Chas has proven to be one of
these types of people. He talks real pretty, trys to display a higher
education, and out of what he would like you to believe is random,
talks a real good anti-Jeffco story. But I know for a fact Jeffco and
all officials in Jeffco are knowingly taking part in high levels of
fraud in almost all channels of government regarding all activity of
government (county).
And I believe Chas is one of their hired "he's just a citizen" stooge,
who talks a good show, who now that they are shuffling in new
presences for the sheriff, they need to make it look as if this
sheriff and the last sheriff who was removed because they say he was a
drunk (he wasn't, it was all staged, apparently many shuffles of power
is believed to be a true change in power), and the last sheriff
(Stone, the hired fall guy paid 2 million for his psyop work), are not
working together but instead separate interests or "new presence". But
the truth of the matter is they're all front men hired by Hollywood
people to play act. And Chas is support staff and I believe he's being
supplimented someway.
But that's irrelevant to his self-propping of his abilities, all talk
and propaganda. No fighting, he refuses to fight anyone, and like I
said, Tiger Kim, JW Kim, Ki Martial Arts, U.S. Tae Kwon Do Center,
Martinez TKD are all highly skilled in knife fighting, yet Chas won't
spar with them, compete with them, simply because his lies won't hold
up once he's been beaten publically.
Look at the photos in Inside KungFu of Gartin, they are absolutely
hilarious. Clearly by these photos he does not have a clue about real
fighting.
Chas & Gartin are con-artists, and I believe Chas is a government
propaganda person who plays "just ordinary citizen who is pissed".
It doesn't really matter, the guy can't fight if his life dependended
on it.
Earl Camembert
2004-05-24 14:09:29 UTC
Permalink
On Sun, 23 May 2004 22:17:06 -0600, "Steve Gartin"
Post by Steve Gartin
Good day all,
Once again Mark Zahn has issued challenges and then failed to appear.
www.tendjek.com/kempofirst.htm
Good night.
Steve :-)>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
OK, I will take up the challenge. I don't believe ZZ Top can fight.
LIBERATOR
2004-05-24 16:43:55 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Gartin
Good day all,
Once again Mark Zahn has issued challenges and then failed to appear.
lol. I didn't appear, so then who did you fight? Who sparred? Oh,
there wasn't any sparring because you don't fight, you only dance.

You didn't give "I accept your challenge and will fight you",
therefore it's clear you're attempting to charge me with assault.

All you have to do is say "I accept your challenge", but we all know
you won't. You made that quite clear by your friend claiming to be a
lawyer saying "I will not waive any laws for Steve Gartin to be hurt".

Remember Gartin? Want me to pull up that post if you've so
conveniently forgot?

But show us the fighting that took place at this seminar. Give any
photo reference of any fighting that took place. Can't can'ya. Cuz you
don't fight, cuz you dont know how.

Invite me for a challenge match if you do. What's wrong?
Post by Steve Gartin
www.tendjek.com/kempofirst.htm
Good night.
Steve :-)>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
www.kuntaosilat.com
Mark Zahn ruiner of Gartin Fraud Witch Con Corp.
www.kuntaosilat.com/Dougco.htm
Steve Gartin : -)>>>>>>>
Post by LIBERATOR
I re-read the story in Inside KungFu Magazine, and noticed there was
no explanation of timing, footwork, cadence, telegraphy, fight
history, but instead a lot of ancient history of which Gartin is
claiming his style has no authentic lineage, that he himself has made
it up by two different countries.
Dutch & Indonesia.
So, as it's reported by Gartin/Jundt in the magazine, they made it up,
and they've never fought themselves and proven it works.
And here in Denver we have 4 schools all Korean domineering experts in
knife fighting, yet Gartin & Chas & their crackpot propaganda bullshit
platoon do everything they can to make sure they never cross paths
with all these schools.
Essentially, when the government commits fraud against trusting
people, they hire propaganda artists. Chas has proven to be one of
these types of people. He talks real pretty, trys to display a higher
education, and out of what he would like you to believe is random,
talks a real good anti-Jeffco story. But I know for a fact Jeffco and
all officials in Jeffco are knowingly taking part in high levels of
fraud in almost all channels of government regarding all activity of
government (county).
And I believe Chas is one of their hired "he's just a citizen" stooge,
who talks a good show, who now that they are shuffling in new
presences for the sheriff, they need to make it look as if this
sheriff and the last sheriff who was removed because they say he was a
drunk (he wasn't, it was all staged, apparently many shuffles of power
is believed to be a true change in power), and the last sheriff
(Stone, the hired fall guy paid 2 million for his psyop work), are not
working together but instead separate interests or "new presence". But
the truth of the matter is they're all front men hired by Hollywood
people to play act. And Chas is support staff and I believe he's being
supplimented someway.
But that's irrelevant to his self-propping of his abilities, all talk
and propaganda. No fighting, he refuses to fight anyone, and like I
said, Tiger Kim, JW Kim, Ki Martial Arts, U.S. Tae Kwon Do Center,
Martinez TKD are all highly skilled in knife fighting, yet Chas won't
spar with them, compete with them, simply because his lies won't hold
up once he's been beaten publically.
Look at the photos in Inside KungFu of Gartin, they are absolutely
hilarious. Clearly by these photos he does not have a clue about real
fighting.
Chas & Gartin are con-artists, and I believe Chas is a government
propaganda person who plays "just ordinary citizen who is pissed".
It doesn't really matter, the guy can't fight if his life dependended
on it.
KunTao Lai Lai
2023-10-08 19:49:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by LIBERATOR
I re-read the story in Inside KungFu Magazine, and noticed there was
no explanation of timing, footwork, cadence, telegraphy, fight
history, but instead a lot of ancient history of which Gartin is
claiming his style has no authentic lineage, that he himself has made
it up by two different countries.
Dutch & Indonesia.
So, as it's reported by Gartin/Jundt in the magazine, they made it up,
and they've never fought themselves and proven it works.
And here in Denver we have 4 schools all Korean domineering experts in
knife fighting, yet Gartin & Chas & their crackpot propaganda bullshit
platoon do everything they can to make sure they never cross paths
with all these schools.
Essentially, when the government commits fraud against trusting
people, they hire propaganda artists. Chas has proven to be one of
these types of people. He talks real pretty, trys to display a higher
education, and out of what he would like you to believe is random,
talks a real good anti-Jeffco story. But I know for a fact Jeffco and
all officials in Jeffco are knowingly taking part in high levels of
fraud in almost all channels of government regarding all activity of
government (county).
And I believe Chas is one of their hired "he's just a citizen" stooge,
who talks a good show, who now that they are shuffling in new
presences for the sheriff, they need to make it look as if this
sheriff and the last sheriff who was removed because they say he was a
drunk (he wasn't, it was all staged, apparently many shuffles of power
is believed to be a true change in power), and the last sheriff
(Stone, the hired fall guy paid 2 million for his psyop work), are not
working together but instead separate interests or "new presence". But
the truth of the matter is they're all front men hired by Hollywood
people to play act. And Chas is support staff and I believe he's being
supplimented someway.
But that's irrelevant to his self-propping of his abilities, all talk
and propaganda. No fighting, he refuses to fight anyone, and like I
said, Tiger Kim, JW Kim, Ki Martial Arts, U.S. Tae Kwon Do Center,
Martinez TKD are all highly skilled in knife fighting, yet Chas won't
spar with them, compete with them, simply because his lies won't hold
up once he's been beaten publically.
Look at the photos in Inside KungFu of Gartin, they are absolutely
hilarious. Clearly by these photos he does not have a clue about real
fighting.
Chas & Gartin are con-artists, and I believe Chas is a government
propaganda person who plays "just ordinary citizen who is pissed".
It doesn't really matter, the guy can't fight if his life dependended
on it.
Greetings. My Uncle was Brendan Lai of the 7 Stars Praying Mantis and was at one time a "Inside Kung Fu" Editor. Brendan Lai is a Martial Arts Hall of Famer in "Black Belt Magazine" several times over and is a icon in the world of Martial Arts. It is impolite to say what you have said because it implies the The De Thouars Family are also fake? They are not and they are a Humble asian Family. IF you only think that Martial Arts is in Korea and Japan or just Chinese then you have missed the point of Martial strategy altogether? When your ego speaks only then your brian does not use you mouth. I will quote the Sages of old that no one ever listens too until they are dead or look like fools. If one talks to a fool one vecomes a fool. Excessive claims of what is a martial art is irrelevant to any Martial Art because Martial Art is STRATEGY! If you depend on anothers strategy to win your wars or your life without your own brain being involved then you truely do not know why the words "I" and Flags or Countries should NEVER be used when addressing Martial Study. "I" does not exist and if there were no flags then there would only be people? “Mistakes are always forgivable, if one has the courage to admit them.” “Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.” “No one should be ashamed to admit they are wrong, which is but saying, in other words, that they are wiser today than they were yesterday.” Lao Tzu...teacher to Confucius. When virtue is lost, benevolence appears, when benevolence is lost right conduct appears, when right conduct is lost, expedience appears. Expediency is the mere shadow of right and truth; it is the beginning of disorder.

Those who have knowledge, don't predict. Those who predict, don't have knowledge.

Let us study firther Moral and mental Strategy which is NEVER taught in American Martial Arts:

The outcome of a fight between warriors was decided by the severity of their wounds.
...one must look beyond the wounds to win the fight. “The purpose of today’s training is to defeat yesterday’s understanding.”
To win any battle, you must fight as if you are already dead. You win battles by knowing the enemy’s timing, and using a timing which the enemy does not expect. The important thing in strategy is to suppress the enemy's useful actions but allow his useless actions.
The path that leads to truth is littered with the bodies of the ignorant.


"Silence is better than unmeaning words."
-Pathagoras

"A system of morality which is based on relative emotional values is a mere illusion, a thoroughly vulgar conception which has nothing sound in it and nothing true."
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